#clojure log - Aug 30 2008

The Joy of Clojure
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8:18 wlr: rhickey: i would be interested in your study group.

9:29 rhickey: wlr: ok, that makes one so far :)

9:33 wlr: rhickey: sounds like a "crash course" before your Boston lisp session ;-)

9:34 rhickey: wlr: I may not get the study group up and running before that. I also have the JVM Languages Summit coming up

9:34 kotarak: rhickey: make it two, but it heavily depends on the time (I'm in Germany)

9:35 what kind of topics do you intend to discuss in the study group?

9:35 wlr: rhickey: np, here.

9:44 rhickey: kotarak: The idea would be to go through the language in, say, 10 weeks, instead of the 90 minutes I usually have, with more interaction and questions

9:45 Like an in-person study group/meetup, which BTW, I'd be happy to conduct in the NY area if there was enough interest

10:36 kid_meier: rhickey: Where is this first study group being conducted?

10:37 rhickey: kid_meier: just an idea right now - online on something like yugma: http://www.yugma.com/

11:32 kotarak: How does one handle this Exception throwing stuff in Java? I want to rewrite my lazy-map in Java, since there were some issues with the proxy implementation. But eg. MapEntry.getValue does not throw an exception, but in my case it could happen. How do I propagate this to the surroundings?

11:42 rhickey: kotarak: one curses the abomination that is checked exceptions

11:56 hoeck_: rhickey: uploaded print.clj to the files section in the google group

11:57 rhickey: hoeck_: thanks, I'll have a look soon

13:35 kotarak: rhickey: (concerning the exceptions) I interpret your answer as "Abandon all hope!", right?

13:36 rhickey: no, what is normally done is catch the exception and rethrow a RuntimeException with the real exception as the cause

13:37 kotarak: aha. Is this "recommended" practice for Clojure connected projects? ie. can one live with it or is it even worse.

13:38 rhickey: I've had to do it many times

13:39 there's no alternative when implementing an interface that doesn't declare exceptions

13:39 checked exceptions are a serious anti-feature

13:40 kotarak: Ok. Then I will simply go with it as necessary evil. I don't know Java very well, so I don't really know, what's the Right Way(tm) in such cases. In case it's usual practice (eg. because there is no other way) that's fine with me.

13:41 I don't like such bondage'n'discipline style "features".

13:55 Ah. Works. :) Maybe not perfect, but we don't throw exceptions anyway. ;)

13:59 rhickey: Is there a special reason, why you added key and val to IMapEntry?

14:00 rhickey: originally IMapEntry didn't extend Map.Entry

14:00 kotarak: ah. ok.

21:40 blackdog: with the new library stuff do i have to put all my single clj files in their own dir?

21:41 like if i have utils/http.clj and utils/json.clj

21:41 it seems that it needs to be utils/http/http.clj etc

21:41 rhickey: each namespace needs a dir

21:41 blackdog: ok

21:42 bummer :) one thing i like about clojure is the flatness, but i realise you need it for ddebugging etc

21:44 kid_meier: blackdog: if i'm not mistaken, you could keep a flat directory structure and just use (load-resource)

21:45 blackdog: yea,

21:45 kid_meier: I agree though, my initial thoughts with the way the lib stuff worked out was that there was one more level of directory than I would prefer.

21:46 but given the desire for hierarchical namespaces, i think the approach that was taken is the most consistent and easy to understand.

21:46 blackdog: yes i agree cant argue with the logic

21:47 i just really dislike descending 5 or 6 levels of directory to get to code

21:48 well maybe thats excessive :)

21:48 kid_meier: ya true. I guess in Java-land things like Eclipse nicely hide that.

22:54 blackdog: so if I'm in a lib and i just want to load other clj that are in the same namespace then I just do (load-resources "my.clj") ?

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